How Two Families Were Pulled Apart
A conflation is only as durable as the reading that created it. This one survived because two families who married on the same day were copied from tree to tree without anyone returning to the register that had always kept them apart.
This page sets out the evidence behind the case study: which records establish which facts, how the two couples were distinguished, and where the documentation reaches its honest limits. Every conclusion is tied to a specific source, and the surviving questions are named as openly as the answered ones.
The central identification — that the Sorel-born Joseph Delard is the Joseph Delard/Delore of French Prairie — is independently supported by a published proof narrative by Connie Lenzen, CG, a Certified Genealogist. Her ten-page study, documented across sixty-four source notes, reaches the same core conclusions from the same body of records. Where her work supplies detail beyond the scope of this analysis — the land-claim survey, the citizenship filings, the Champoeg vote — it is cited directly below.
The Central Problem This Case Addresses
Standard genealogical practice requires correlating evidence across independent sources and documenting every claim to a primary record. This case began with a pattern familiar from the Quintal–Nipissing correction: widely circulated family trees for Joseph Delard and Lisette carry no primary source citations, and the identity they assign to Lisette — Chinook, daughter of the head chief Comcomly — is contradicted by a register that has been in print for half a century.
Here the error has a documentable mechanism. Two different men named Joseph, from two different Québec parishes, each married a woman named Lisette at the same January 1839 mission ceremony. The public trees collapsed the two couples into one, and the Chinook identity of one bride migrated onto the Shuswap identity of the other. The correction is not a matter of interpretation. The register records two marriages. The two Lisettes died two deaths, ten years apart. The case requires only that the sources be read — in full, not in fragments.
Read the 1839 register in full, not in fragments
The starting point was the complete January 1839 marriage series recorded by Father François Norbert Blanchet at the Willamette mission, as published in the Catholic Church Records of the Pacific Northwest (Munnick). Entry M15 records Joseph Delard, of Sorel, marrying Lisette Souchouabe, with a legitimation clause naming six children by age. A separate entry, M5, records Joseph Despard, of Saint-Hyacinthe, marrying Lisette Tchinouke, with a wholly different set of four children.
The two entries share the date, the priest, the two witnesses, the grooms’ given name, and the brides’ given name. Everything that identifies a family — origin parish, nation, children — differs. The conflation collapses M5 and M15; the register keeps them apart.
Prove the two Lisettes were two women by their baptisms and deaths
Each bride was baptized on her wedding day in her own entry: B38, Lisette, aged 32, of the Souchoabe (Shuswap); and B27, Lisette, of the Tchinouke (Chinook). The decisive separation came from the deaths. Lisette Souchouabe, the Shuswap wife of Joseph Delard, died on 19 February 1841 and was buried at St. Paul the next day, her age given as 36. Lisette, named as the wife of Joseph Despard in her own death entry, died at St. Paul on April 27, 1851, “aged 43 years.”
Two women, two nations, two deaths a decade apart. The Chinook identity, and with it any connection to the head chief Comcomly, belongs to the woman who died in 1851 — not to the Shuswap woman who died in 1841.
Lisette Souchouabe’s burial: St. Paul register S-2, 20 February 1841, as quoted by Connie Lenzen, CG, “Joseph Delard,” n. 23. The Chinook Lisette’s death is known from the annotations to the published register. Original register entries are to be obtained from the Archdiocese of Portland (see Open Research Questions).Confirm the register’s own editor kept them separate
The published index indexes Delard and Despard as distinct surname blocks, each with its own cross-references to M15 and M5. The editor, working from the original registers, never treated the two names as variants of one family. The families’ separateness is not a modern reinterpretation — it is preserved in both the register and its scholarly index. Outside the mission registers, the two Josephs stand on consecutive lines of the Hudson’s Bay Company’s 1824 servants’ abstract — Deslard of Sorel, a steersman, and a Joseph Dispard of Yamaska, a middleman — each with his own age and length of service.
Trace Joseph’s line, generation by generation, to France
With the couple correctly identified, Joseph Delard’s ancestry was documented backward through the Programme de recherche en démographie historique (PRDH-IGD) and the underlying parish registers: his 1792 Sorel baptism (#455108); his father François, baptized 1753, married Catherine Lavallée 1781 (#133148, #57042); his grandfather François the immigrant, born about 1725 at St-Georges, Lascabanes, diocese of Cahors (#135998), married at St-Laurent, Île d’Orléans, in 1748 (#142223); and behind him Guillaume Delard and Jeanne Verdon in France (#135996, #135997).
The Québec record falls silent on Joseph after 1792 — no marriage, no burial there — consistent with a man who married and died in Oregon. The two record sets meet without overlap or contradiction.
Read the line forward to the Quintal junction
Joseph and Lisette’s son Augustin Delard married Zoé Quintal at St. Louis Church, Marion County, on August 25, 1857. The marriage record names both parent-couples in a single entry, joining this family to the Quintal–Nipissing line documented separately in these pages.
The Oregon settlement record — the Champoeg vote of 2 May 1843, the citizenship declaration of 1849 and final papers of 1864, and the Grand Prairie land claims near St. Louis church — is set out in detail in the Lenzen proof narrative, whose findings align with the record at every point.
The 1850 census corroborates the family structure from the other direction: Augustin, Bazile, and Antoine are in their father’s household eleven years after the legitimation, and Pierre heads his own household two dwellings away. Their stated ages, however, run two to four years older than the M15 ages imply — Antoine, nine months old in January 1839, is listed at 15 — the usual drift of household-reported ages, and a reason the M15 clause, not the census, anchors their birth years. The same household lists Marguerite at age 3 (born about 1847): born after Lisette’s 1841 death and the 1843 second marriage, she is a child of Marie Poirier, not of Lisette — a distinction the merged trees routinely lose.
Champoeg vote, citizenship, and land-claim particulars: Connie Lenzen, CG, “Joseph Delard,” pp. 4–5, notes 35–38, 43. 1850 census schedule examined directly (NARA M432, Marion Co., p. 102, dwellings 436 and 438); 1860 and 1845 per Lenzen’s transcription (see Source Inventory).Name the limits honestly
Lisette Souchouabe’s baptism records her as born of non-Christian parents of the Shuswap nation, naming neither. Her ancestry beyond herself reaches an honest limit there. No baptism has been located for her son Augustin; his birth (about 1826–27) rests on his stated age of 12 in the 1839 legitimation, and his reported birthplace of Fort Kamloops is drawn from later compiled sources. Joseph’s fur-trade service — read from the North West Company and Hudson’s Bay Company account books and his 1817 Montreal engagement — is documented in the companion study, The Steersman’s Ledger.
Every primary source cited in this case study, with transcriptions and analytical notes. Pages of the published register edition and PRDH database cards are not reproduced here; the facts they record are set out in transcription tables, each tied to its entry or record number. Click any image to view full size.
The Two Marriages the Trees MergedRegister Entries
These are the two entries at the heart of the conflation, recorded the same day by the same priest, before the same witnesses. Set side by side, they share everything except what identifies a family.
| Element | M5 | M15 |
|---|---|---|
| Groom | Joseph Despard | Joseph Delard |
| Groom’s origin | Saint-Hyacinthe, District of Montreal, Canada; farmer of this place | “of Sorel, in Canada”; farmer of this place |
| Bride | Lisette, Tchinouke (Chinook) by nation | Lisette, Souchouabe (Shuswap) by nation |
| Banns | Two dispensed, third published | Two dispensed, third published |
| Children legitimized | Joseph (12), Marie Anne (5), Rose (3), Marguerite (one year old the following 18 April) | Pierre (15), Catherine (17), Augustin (12), Basile (6), Marie Anne (3), Antoine (9 months) |
| Witnesses | Jean Baptiste Dupati, Pierre Stanislas Jacquet | Jean Baptiste Dupati, Pierre Stanislas Jacquet |
| Signatures | Spouses and witnesses could not sign | Spouses and witnesses could not sign |
| Officiant | F.N. Blanchet, priest | F.N. Blanchet, priest |
Different origin parishes. Different brides’ nations. Wholly different children. The register never confused the two couples; the public trees did. M15 names six children, Catherine the eldest at 17 — the same six later listed as surviving their mother.
The Next Morning — the Children BaptizedRegister Entries
On 22 January, the day after the marriages, Blanchet baptized the younger children of both couples, one entry each. Every entry names both parents, and the Delard ages match the M15 legitimation exactly.
| Entry | Child, age | Parents named |
|---|---|---|
| B53 | Marie Anne Delard, 3 years | Joseph Delard, farmer of this place, and Lisette Souchouabe |
| B54 | Basile Delard, 6 years | Joseph Delard and Lisette Souchouabe |
| B55 | Antoine Delard, 9 months | Joseph Delard and Lisette Souchouabe |
| B57 | Marie Anne Despard, 5 years | Joseph Despard, farmer of this place, and Lisette Tchinouk |
| B58 | Rose Despard, 3 years | Joseph Despard and Lisette Tchinouk |
Two Marie Annes, baptized four entries apart — one a Delard aged 3, one a Despard aged 5, each tied to her own father and her own mother. Even the shared child’s name could not merge the families in the register. Lisette’s three eldest were baptized later: Catherine at St. Paul in July 1841, aged 20, and Pierre in September 1842, aged 18 (per Lenzen, nn. 24, 28); no baptism has been found for Augustin.
Adult Baptism of Lisette SouchouabeRegister Entry
Baptized on the day of her marriage, in the standard Columbia District regularization pattern. This record is the evidentiary floor for Lisette’s identity — and its two most important features are what it states and what it does not.
| Baptized | Lisette |
| Stated age | 32 years (born about 1806–07) |
| Parents | Not named — non-Christian parents, “Indians of Souchoabe” |
| Nation | Souchoabe — Shuswap (editor’s gloss) |
| Godfather | Etienne Lussier, who could not sign |
| Officiant | F.N. Blanchet, priest |
What it states: her nation — Souchoabe (Shuswap) — and her approximate birth, about 1806–07. What it does not state: any parent’s name. The Comcomly parentage circulating in the online trees has no basis in this record or any other; it belongs to the other Lisette at the same wedding, baptized the same morning as B27 — Lisette, of the Tchinouke.
Lisette’s Death and the Six Surviving ChildrenCompiled Source
| Name | Lisette Shuswap (Souchouabe) |
| Husband | Joseph Delard, married at the January 1839 “Big Wedding” |
| Died | 19 February 1841 (“deceased yesterday”) |
| Burial | 20 February 1841, St. Paul parish cemetery, as legitimate wife of Joseph Delard |
| Age at burial | 36 years (born about 1805) |
| Surviving children | Catherine, Pierre, Augustin, Basile, Marie Anne, Antoine |
| Birth (derived) | About 1806–07 from her baptism (aged 32); about 1805 from her burial (aged 36) and the Early Oregonian |
An independent enumeration of the child-set, recorded at her death — matching the six M15 children exactly and excluding the Despard children (Rose, Marguerite). Her two register ages disagree by four years — 32 at baptism, 36 at burial two years later — the ordinary looseness of ages given for an adult Indigenous woman, and the reason her birth is stated as a range.
The Other Lisette — Chinook, Died 1851Compiled Source
| Name | Lisette, Chinook |
| Husband | Joseph Despard — named in the entry |
| Died | 27 April 1851, St. Paul |
| Stated age | “aged 43 years” (born about 1808) |
| Burial | The old cemetery at St. Paul |
The record that severs the two women definitively — and it names the husband directly. Ten years after Lisette Souchouabe’s death: a different nation, a different death, a different husband. Any Chinook identity — and any connection to the head chief Comcomly — belongs to this woman’s family, not to the Shuswap wife of Joseph Delard.
The Index Keeps Them ApartCompiled Source
| Surname block | Entries indexed | Keyed to |
|---|---|---|
| Delard | Augustin, Basile, Catherine, Joseph (“to Lisette, Shuswap”), Marie Anne, Pierre | M15, 29th page; children’s baptisms, 30th page |
| Despard | Joseph (“to Lisette, Chinook”), Joseph Frederic, Marguerite, Marie Anne, Rose | M5, 27th page; B22, 25th page; B57–B58, 30th page |
The editor, working from the original registers, kept the two names as distinct surname blocks with separate cross-references, and never treated them as variants of one family. The index even carries a second Despard heading, Joseph Frederic (1788–1875), kept apart from the Joseph who married Lisette — the same discipline, applied by the editor within a single surname. The separateness is not a modern reinterpretation; it is preserved in both the register and its scholarly apparatus.
Joseph’s Baptism, 1792Primary
| Name | Joseph DELARD |
| Father | François DELARD |
| Mother | Catherine LAVALLÉE |
| Birth | 30 December 1792 |
| Baptism | 30 December 1792, Sorel (St-Pierre) |
| Later Québec events | None recorded — no marriage, no burial |
The PRDH — a near-complete reconstitution of Catholic Québec — shows no other Joseph Delard baptized at Sorel in this era. And the Québec record falls silent on him after this entry. That silence is consistent negative evidence for emigration — exactly what one expects of a man who married and died in Oregon. The Québec record and the Oregon record meet with no overlap and no contradiction.
The Immigrant’s Origin — Cahors, FrancePrimary
| Name | François DELARD |
| Father | Guillaume DELARD |
| Mother | Jeanne VERDON |
| Birth | Around 1725, St-Georges, Lascabanes, diocese of Cahors, Guyenne (district of Cahors, Lot) |
| First marriage | 8 August 1748, St-Laurent (Île d’Orléans), to Marie Thérèse THERRIEN, daughter of Guillaume Therrien and Marie Anne Jahan Laviolette |
| Second marriage | 26 November 1754, Québec (Notre-Dame-de-Québec), to Marie Anne BLAIS, daughter of Antoine Blais and Ambroise Françoise Fournier |
| Burial | 29 April 1797, Montréal (Notre-Dame-de-Montréal) |
The French origin is stated in the record — not inferred from the surname or family tradition. The full documented chain runs: Guillaume Delard & Jeanne Verdon (France) → François the immigrant (b. ~1725, Cahors) → François (b. 1753, m. Catherine Lavallée 1781, Sorel; PRDH #133148, #57042) → Joseph (b. 1792, Sorel). Joseph descends through the first marriage; the maternal line behind it carries seventeenth-century Québec depth through the Therrien, Jahan Laviolette, and Trépanier families (PRDH #12544, #5760).
The 1850 Census — Two Delard HouseholdsPrimary
436: Pierre Delard 30, farmer · Josephte 19 · Julienne · Joseph 1
438: Joseph Delard 49, farmer, b. Canada · Marie 24, b. O.T. · Augustin 25 · Bazile 19 · Antoine 15 · Margarite 3 · Narcisse Montignie 33
The census confirms the family from the other direction: three of Lisette’s sons in their father’s household eleven years after the legitimation, and the eldest, Pierre — married to Josephte Lapierre in 1846 (M-23, per Lenzen) — settled two dwellings away on Grand Prairie. Their ages run two to four years older than the M15 clause implies; Antoine, nine months old in January 1839, is listed at 15. Marguerite at 3 (born about 1847) is the critical detail: born after Lisette’s 1841 death and after the 1843 second marriage, she is a child of Marie Poirier, not of Lisette. The merged trees routinely lose this distinction.
The Second Wife — Marie Toussaint PoirierCorroborating
Marriage: Joseph Delard, January 1843, Marion Co. (exact day not established) · Parents: Toussaint Poirier & Catherine Clatsop · Born: Nov 1819 (alt. Nov 1825), St. Louis, Marion Co. · Ethnicity: ½ Indian · Died: 15 April 1914, St. Joseph’s Home, Portland · Sources cited: St. Paul I 65-M13; St. Paul annotations and records
The exact day of the marriage is not established: the database and Lenzen’s quotation of the St. Paul entry (M-13) give different days in January 1843, and the published register’s annotation for Marie gives none. The entry Lenzen quotes also names Joseph the widower of “Elizabeth Shoushwab” — Lisette’s Shuswap nation, stated again in an independent record two years after her death. Joseph remarried less than two years after Lisette’s death. Marie Toussaint Poirier’s children are a distinct set from Lisette’s six, and the census Marguerite above is the data point that cleanly divides the two families. Her father, Toussaint Poirier, served in the North West Company alongside Joseph — both rated bout on the same page of the 1821 dissolution ledger.
The Junction — Augustin Delard and Zoé QuintalRegister Entry
| Groom | Augustin Dellart (Delard) |
| Groom’s parents | Joseph Dellart and Lisette, a native woman, deceased |
| Bride | Zoé Quintal |
| Bride’s parents | Laurent Quintal and Marie Ann Nipissing, living in the Umpqua country |
| Witnesses | Joseph Dellart, Louis Quintal, Louis Vandale |
One entry names both parent-couples, joining the Delard family to the Quintal–Nipissing line documented separately in these pages.
21 Jan 1839
Marriage of Joseph Delard and Lisette Souchouabe, with legitimation of six children. Groom of Sorel, farmer of this place; bride Souchouabe (Shuswap) by nation. Children by age: Pierre (15), Catherine (17), Augustin (12), Basile (6), Marie Anne (3), Antoine (9 mo.). Witnesses: Jean Baptiste Dupati, Pierre Stanislas Jacquet. Priest: F.N. Blanchet. The anchor record for the family.
21 Jan 1839
Marriage of Joseph Despard and Lisette Tchinouke — the separate couple. Groom of Saint-Hyacinthe, District of Montreal. Children: Joseph (12), Marie Anne (5), Rose (3), Marguerite (one year old the following 18 April). Same day, same witnesses, same priest as M15 — but a different family entirely. The conflation of M5 and M15 is the documented mechanism of the circulating error.
21 Jan 1839
Adult baptisms of the two Lisettes. B38: Lisette, aged 32, of the Souchoabe (Shuswap); parents not named; godfather Etienne Lussier — the evidentiary floor for her identity. B27: Lisette, of the Tchinouke (Chinook), baptized the same day — the Despard bride’s own entry.
d. Feb 1841
Death and burial of Lisette Souchouabe, with six surviving children. Burial S-2, St. Paul, 20 February 1841: legitimate wife of Joseph Delard, died the day before, aged 36 (per Lenzen, n. 23). Editor’s annotation: surviving children Catherine, Pierre, Augustin, Basile, Marie Anne, Antoine — the M15 set exactly, excluding the Despard children.
d. 27 Apr 1851
Death of Lisette, Chinook — named as Despard’s wife in the entry. Died at St. Paul, 27 April 1851, “aged 43 years” (b. ~1808); buried in the old cemetery. Ten years after Lisette Souchouabe. The record that definitively severs the two women and returns the Chinook/Comcomly attribution to the correct family.
pp. 30–31
Published surname index — Delard and Despard as separate blocks. Delard: Augustin, Basile, Catherine, Joseph (“to Lisette, Shuswap”), Marie Anne, Pierre. Despard: Joseph (“to Lisette, Chinook”), Joseph Frederic, Marguerite, Marie Anne, Rose. The editor never merged the two families.
22 Jan 1839
Baptisms of Marie Anne (3), Basile (6), and Antoine (9 months) Delard, children of Joseph Delard and Lisette Souchouabe. Ages identical to the M15 legitimation. Despard children Marie Anne (5) and Rose (3) baptized in the same series as B57–B58. Catherine (bap. July 1841, aged 20) and Pierre (bap. September 1842, aged 18) per Lenzen, nn. 24, 28.
3 Aug 1846
Marriage of Pierre Delard and Josephte Lapierre, St. Paul. The eldest son’s marriage — Josephte is a Delard daughter-in-law, not a Delard daughter. Corroborated by the 1850 census (dwelling 436) and by Lenzen, note 51.
#455108
Joseph Delard — born and baptized 30 December 1792, Sorel (St-Pierre). Son of François Delard and Catherine Lavallée. The single documented Joseph Delard of that parish and era; no Québec marriage or burial follows — consistent negative evidence for emigration.
#133148 · #57042
François Delard (b. 1753) × Catherine Lavallée, m. 8 January 1781, Sorel. Joseph’s father — baptized 1 Dec 1753, St-Pierre-de-la-Rivière-du-Sud; d. 19 Jan 1820, Sorel. The family record (#57042) lists Joseph among 13 children and shows no further Québec event for him.
#135998 · #142223
François Delard the immigrant — b. ~1725, St-Georges, Lascabanes, diocese of Cahors, Guyenne (Lot), France. Married (1) Marie Thérèse Therrien, 8 August 1748, St-Laurent (Île d'Orléans); (2) Marie Anne Blais, 26 November 1754, Québec. Parents: Guillaume Delard & Jeanne Verdon (#135996, #135997), in France. Buried 29 April 1797, Montréal.
#12544 · #5760
Maternal depth — Therrien, Jahan Laviolette, Trépanier. Marie Thérèse Therrien (bap. 1722, St-Jean, Île d'Orléans) ← Guillaume Therrien × M.A. Jahan Laviolette (m. 1717) ← Jacques Jahan Laviolette × M.A. Trépanier (m. 1686, Château-Richer). Seventeenth-century Québec founding-era documentation behind the immigrant’s wife.
Marion Co., p.102
Dwellings 436 and 438 — the two Delard households. Schedule image examined. 438: Joseph (49), Marie (24), Augustin (25), Bazile (19), Antoine (15), Margarite (3), Narcisse Montignie (33). 436: Pierre Delard (30) with Josephte (19), Julienne, and Joseph. Children’s ages run two to four years above those implied by M15; Marguerite (b. ~1847) is a Poirier child — the data point that divides the two wives’ child-sets. NARA M432.
Marion Co.
Peter/Joseph Delore household, Labish. Per Lenzen’s transcription; located via AIS Compiled Census Index. Original schedule not personally examined — retrieval pending. NARA M653.
Champoeg Co.
Joseph Deslards household, 1845 Oregon Territorial Census. Per Lenzen, citing USGenWeb transcription (T. Neal). Original: Oregon State Archives, Docs. 12188–12277b. Original not personally examined.
25 Aug 1857
Marriage of Augustin Delard and Zoé Quintal — the junction record. Names both parent-couples in one entry: Augustin, legal son of Joseph Dellart and the late Lisette, a native woman; Zoé, daughter of Laurent Quintal and Marie Ann Nipissing. Witnesses: Joseph Dellart, Louis Quintal, Louis Vandale. Links this family to the separately documented Quintal–Nipissing line.
Database
Multiple records — Joseph Delard, Lisette Shuswap, Marie Toussaint Poirier, Augustin Delard. Joseph: b. 30 Dec 1792 (alt. 1794), Sorel; arrival 1815; d. 26 Aug 1869, St. Louis, Marion Co.; alias “Delore, Peter.” Lisette: “Sochanale Indian,” b. 1805 (variant), d. 19 Feb 1841, no parents listed. Marie Toussaint Poirier: m. January 1843 (day not established); parents Toussaint Poirier & Catherine Clatsop. Augustin: alias “Delore, Quinn”; b. 1825 (alt. 1826), Ft. Kamloops, BC; “½ Indian”; parents Joseph Delard & Lisette Shuswap; d. 26 Oct 1891, Suplee, Crook Co. The 1815 arrival is a compiled value; Joseph’s Montreal engagement of 3 January 1817 places his departure west in that year.
"Joseph Delard"
Connie Lenzen, CG — ten-page proof narrative, 64 source notes. Independently reaches the same core identification (Sorel-born Joseph = French Prairie Joseph) from the same body of records. Cited in this study only where it supplies detail beyond scope: the Champoeg vote (2 May 1843, voted against organization), citizenship (declared 21 Apr 1849; final papers 10 Oct 1864), the Grand Prairie land claims (483.45 acres; 1852 survey; neighbors Ogle and Laderoute), and the 1845/1860 census transcriptions.
1813–1836
Joseph’s fur-trade career, from the account books. North West Company and Hudson’s Bay Company records (F.4/5, F.4/32, F.4/46, B.239/g/1–16) and the 3 January 1817 Montreal engagement of “Joseph Delard de Sorel.” Set out in full in The Steersman’s Ledger and its methodology.
parents
Not named in any located record. Her baptism records her as born of non-Christian parents of the Shuswap nation, naming neither. Her ancestry beyond herself may lie outside the documentary reach of the mission registers — an honest limit, stated as such.
baptism
No baptism located. Not in the January 1839 series, where his three youngest siblings were baptized (B53–B55), nor among the 1841–42 St. Paul baptisms of Catherine and Pierre. His birth (about 1826–27) rests on his stated age of 12 in M15; his reported Fort Kamloops birthplace is drawn from compiled sources. Candidate repositories: HBCA Thompson’s River/Kamloops post records; St-Boniface if the family cycled through Red River.
register entries
M5, M15, B27, B38 and both Lisettes’ burials from the original St. Paul / Willamette register. Consulted to date through the published edition and its annotations. Certified copies from the Archdiocese of Portland would allow a fresh transcription from the French and upgrade every citation in this group.
schedules
Original schedule images to retrieve. The 1850 schedule has been examined; the 1860 federal and 1845 territorial schedules are consulted to date via index and published transcription only.